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Post by Justin on Dec 15, 2013 19:35:16 GMT -5
I am pretty sure this is the wrong site for this, as there are tons of Pens fans here, but does anyone else think it's bullshit Neal (suspended twice previously) gets 5 games for intentionally kneeing a downed skater in the head, and Thornton (never previously suspended) gets 15 for a couple half-cocked punches to someone (Orpik - suspended twice previously) who previously clobbered someone with a shady hit? I mean, hell, you cannot even knee someone in the head when they are down in the UFC for fuck sakes. But I guess if you are on the Penguins, in Bettman's NHL, you can do whatever you want (notice the non-call on the Sidney trip on that same play? Yeah, me too).
Unrelated, but related: Back in my day, without the instigator rule, Thornton fights Orpik earlier in the game, when Thornton approached him directly and both were ready/standing, and that issue is resolved before it even starts.
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Post by Pittsburgh Penguins GM on Dec 15, 2013 19:45:32 GMT -5
I agree Neal should have received more, it was definitely intentional. Thornton and the Bruins as a whole try and bully teams. No way in the world would I if I was Orpik have fought him. Thornton's only good on the ice is to bully players. He is just a plug on the ice. You don't fight a plug when you are a valuable player. You start the fighting crap against Boston and you are just playing into there game. But yes Neal should have received more for that.
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Post by Pittsburgh Penguins GM on Dec 15, 2013 19:49:33 GMT -5
as for missing Sid's trip. The refs miss 100 calls a game, you don't have to be Sid. The majority of the Penalties they call on him are bullshit. But I guess when the majority of your games are against players that are very weak on there skates and they fall done with just a touch you are in trouble. Refing as a hole in the NHL ins a joke. If a guy that is strong on his skates and gets crosschecked there is no penalty, but if he is weak on his skates and fall down there is a penalty LOL. There are probably over 100 crosschecks in every game in NHL.
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Post by Justin on Dec 15, 2013 19:50:38 GMT -5
Fine, but Thornton was not bullying Orpik. Orpik cheese-fucked one of Boston's players first. As a classic-role enforcer, it would obviously be Thorton's job to go slap a bit of sense into Orpik, then the issue is resolved. Instead, Orpik bitch-dodges him, and you get this sloppy mess that is this new NHL.
And I agree with much of your second point. Crosschecking is a big problem I see a lot of non-calls on for exactly what you said - guy doesn't fall or turtle. But it could still injure someone and should be penalized.
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Post by Colorado Avalanche GM on Dec 15, 2013 20:50:03 GMT -5
You can't expect Orpik to fight Thornton.
Orpik's punishment should have came from the collective team - hitting him, slashing him chirping him and someone in his weight class fighting. Thornton is a heavyweight goon. Orpik is not.
Neal should've gotten 10+.
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Post by The Admin Account on Dec 15, 2013 23:02:26 GMT -5
Landsberg had a good question, what's worst? What Thornton did or deliberately kneeing someone in the head who is down on the ice.
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Post by Pittsburgh Penguins GM on Dec 16, 2013 20:23:56 GMT -5
both are gutlessmoves. Thornton punches a guys 3 times after he is knocked out from the first one and Neal was just plan stupid and should have been major suspension. The NHL is afraid to actually try and control this the right way.
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Post by Justin on Dec 16, 2013 21:28:20 GMT -5
I still say the right way is drop the instigator penalty and let guys police properly. Too much bitch-slapping and crap now.
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Post by Pittsburgh Penguins GM on Dec 17, 2013 1:47:43 GMT -5
Yes drop the instigator. THey set things up that there suppose to be no staged fighting and that is all there is with the instigator taken out. It is a complete joke to watch two guys shake there heads at each other at the faceoff circle and then fight. That has nothing to do with the game of hockey and is a complete joke
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Post by Mike - Former Wild GM on Dec 17, 2013 6:45:54 GMT -5
There's a lot of comments here that I liked. I look forward to the transition to new proboards so I can like comments on here. Neal should have received 8 games, Thornton around 12, but I guess if the NHL is trying to set new examples regarding fighting then I guess this is what we can expect moving forward.
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Post by Smolik20 - Retired Blues GM on Dec 17, 2013 11:02:05 GMT -5
I agree with all of you that Neal should have received way more than just 5 games. That was a dirty, dirty play and it did not need to happen at all.
As for the Thornton play, I think 15 games is fair. I am pretty sick and tired of todays NHL where if you make a big, clean check, you are expected to have to drop the gloves and fight. Last time I checked, hitting was part of the game. I understand fighting over dirty hits but Orpiks was not a dirty hit.
I am a big Ottawa fan and what comes to mind about this incident was the Cooke on Karlsson play and for the rest of that game and the next meeting between the 2 teams, Neil wanted to fight Cooke all game long but Cooke wouldn't give in. As much as I wanted them to go, Cooke was the smarter player and didn't give in but Neil didn't chase him down and sucker him a couple of times.
Frustration is a big part of the game but Thornton was way out of line and if he needed to let out some aggression, he should have looked elsewhere for a willing combatant because obviously Orpik was not going to fight if he didn't drop them right away after the hit occurred.
just my 2 cents
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Post by Pittsburgh Penguins GM on Dec 17, 2013 18:21:10 GMT -5
If you have a guy that doesn't want to engage you, you can just dump the puck into his corner and pound on him every chance you get. We did that with players we didn't like for years. Make them play the puck and grind on them all game long. It is a lot more fun fighting a guy that is just going to tie you up and wait for the refs.
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Post by Boston Bruins GM on Dec 17, 2013 19:10:32 GMT -5
I still say the right way is drop the instigator penalty and let guys police properly. Too much bitch-slapping and crap now. 100% agree. The game would be much safer this way. Players would think twice before running someone or taking cheap shots at top players if they knew there were going to be consiquences. I'm not a Pens fan but just look at everything Crosby has been put through. That never happened to Gretzky. People knew better with guys like Semenko and McSorley watching his back.
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Post by Yup - Former Jets GM on Dec 17, 2013 22:46:35 GMT -5
You guys see Brayden Schenn get levelled tonight? What are your thoughts on that? Suspension? If so how many games?
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Post by Florida Panthers GM on Dec 20, 2013 11:16:35 GMT -5
Minnisota probably had a heart attack when schenn got hit .
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